Unraveling the Art of Cigar Construction: From Tobacco Leaf to Flavor Profile Exploration

Speaker 1: 0:01

Welcome to the ICRV Radio podcast. You know, normally in this podcast we would tour the various content areas on ICRVradiocom, where we have fresh programming every day that celebrates our towns and villages, our history, our culture and all the life interests that make the Connecticut River Valley so special. We like to say that we make local matter. Today, though, we want to introduce you to a specific program as a way of better understanding the deep dives we do every day into the passions and textured stories that make our part of New England so special. Today we talk tobacco. Our new series, leaf People, is for both the cigar lovers and the cigar novices. It serves up insights into the nuances and history of this amazing art form and allows you to better understand how you can enjoy all things cigars, powered by our friends at the Horsepower Cigar Lounge in Montville, connecticut. Celebrate the rich history of tobacco in Connecticut and beyond with Leaf People.

Speaker 2: 1:10

Welcome to ICRV's premiere episode of Leaf People, a show powered by Horsepower Cigar Lounge, and we're dedicated to improving your cigar knowledge and experience by talking you through some of the important facts and facets of the cigar world. We're on location today at the Horsepower Cigar Lounge in Montville, connecticut, and we're going to be speaking with Paul Appie and Tim Teeber about cigars and the cigar lounge here at Horsepower and we're going to dive into some of the interesting parts of a cigar, as well as how to appreciate that. And for those that have not ever had a cigar, it still might be interesting to you to learn a little bit about what's going on and why there's such a craze about cigars. So first I'd like to introduce Paul, who is a legendary drag racer and owner of Horsepower Cigar Lounge. Welcome, paul.

Speaker 3: 2:12

Thanks, mark, happy to be here and looking forward to having some fun with these shows and helping to spread the knowledge of folks.

Speaker 2: 2:19

Yeah, and so you came up with this crazy idea a few years back to to create this lounge, and you had the idea that you want to make a better mousetrap. Huh.

Speaker 3: 2:32

Well, my wife Tune and I and my friend Tim was right next to me here you know we've traveled the many cigar loungers we've been members at loungers in Rhode Island and Hartford, different places and because we didn't have anything in this area, you know, eastern Connecticut hasn't really had a full cigar lounge experience and we felt it was time to change that and we wanted to create something for the community and that's that's kind of what it's all about and that's why our tagline says it all cigars, great people, atmosphere. You know, that's that's what we do.

Speaker 2: 3:02

Yeah well. So like any great drag racer, you gotta have a great mechanic behind you, and Tim has served that feature. He's also served as your right-hand man here at the at the cigar lounge. Tim you're you really have dive deep into the cigar knowledge and you're kind of the specialist here for for your folks that walk into the lounge and want to know what's going on, what kind of brought you into the fold?

Speaker 4: 3:32

My father was always a cigar smoker. My whole life I was around it and then, just when I was in my early to mid-20s, kind of started dabbling in cigars myself and just found was just a very enjoyable experience. And what's interesting is the more you learn about cigars where they come from, how they're made, the industry as a whole the more you realize there is yet to learn. So it's it's a never-ending process, which makes it super enjoyable.

Speaker 2: 4:04

Yeah, and I think if you talk to anyone here at the lounge you'll find that they definitely love the place, the selection, the people and it really kind of factored into our naming of the show. We call it the the leaf people because obviously we're gonna be talking about the tobacco leaf, but I think it's just as much about the people, the experience of the interaction that you get in a cigar lounge.

Speaker 2: 4:31

Well, I think, as far as you know, my experience with cigars and I've been smoking for quite some time but is that to go and see the cigar and smell it it's helpful, and I think part of what we're trying to make this show about is helping people to better understand what they're looking at, why it's important and and you know how that affects their experience.

Speaker 2: 4:55

And so what we're gonna do is we're gonna break this, this process, into four shows, and today we're gonna be focusing on the construction of cigar, and by that we're talking about how cigars made, why it's made that way, the components, where they're, where they might come from, or why you might use a certain size and how that affects it so a lot to talk about and we have so much to talk about. I think we'll be busy for for years to come on these subjects, but, but today we were going to do a little breakdown of the construction of a cigar. But before we dive too deep into that, I attend when you have someone that comes in the shop and maybe they've been smoking cigars for a while, or maybe they've been curious what?

Speaker 2: 5:46

what do you think is helpful for them to draw their attention to, about what they've done before and what they're looking at in the and the humidor?

Speaker 4: 5:57

well, it starts with you know what seem like very basic questions. You want to establish what their palate is and you can ask them, like you know, what type of foods do they like? They like things that are spicy? Do they like you know certain things, if? If they're coffee drinkers, if they drink spirits, that sort of thing, because when you, when you get into what somebody likes as far as their taste in their palate, then it's a really good jumping off point for getting into.

Speaker 4: 6:26

There's such a variety of cigars. Some are flavor infused, some are just natural, and we'll get into all that, you know, more deeply soon. So it's really trying to pair the right cigar up to each individual and of course you want to start them on the milder side. If they're a novice smoker or they're newer to it, you don't want to overwhelm their palate and have something that really literally leaves a bad taste in their mouth and kind of turns them off, you know from cigars. So you really have to ask a lot of questions and some people are kind of intrigued by the fact that we're asking you know, what do you eat, what do you drink, sort of thing. But it really helps guide us to get in the right direction for them.

Speaker 2: 7:06

So I know some people when they go into a cigar, a humidor, they'll look around and they'll say, oh, I don't want those dark ones, that's too strong for me. Is that a misnomer? Is that somewhat accurate?

Speaker 4: 7:21

Absolutely.

Speaker 2: 7:24

Absolutely a misnomer.

Speaker 4: 7:27

Yes, it is absolutely. One of the biggest misconceptions about cigars is dark means strong. A lot of times the color has nothing to do with the strength of the cigar. A lot of it's done by different. It's different types of plants or a different aging process. That may make it a darker color, but it doesn't necessarily make it stronger. It changes the flavor profile. Some of the lighter colored cigars we have in humidor are actually the strongest. So yeah, that's something that a lot of people misunderstand. It's very common.

Speaker 3: 8:01

And that's also one of the advantages of our setup. Mark, talking about why people would come to a cigar lounge as opposed to online or other options, we have a walk-in humidor where we also have our register inside there and it makes a private experience or semi-private experience if you come in with a couple of folks so you can ask questions and you can learn a type of stuff without feeling awkward, without feeling like, oh, everybody else is listening to what I'm asking. We've all been that new person at one point or another. I mean, it's not like you didn't smoke cigars for a hundred years. At some point you had to start right. And that's one of the great things about our setup is there's no judgment here, and even after you pick something out and you go sit down, it doesn't matter if you picked out a $4 cigar or $20 cigar or whatever it is. Everyone's here for the same reason to relax, converse, if they want to or not, and just enjoy the cigars in the atmosphere, and that's a huge advantage for us.

Speaker 2: 9:00

So we talked briefly about, like when you walk in and see the darkness of a cigar. Now there's also the size of a cigar, and that's two important things to talk about as we move into the construction of a cigar. But size matters, huh.

Speaker 4: 9:17

It certainly does, and you can take the same blend of tobaccos that are three different sizes, maybe a different shape.

Speaker 2: 9:28

And do a lot of people do, that they have the same blend and a bunch of different sizes under one manufacturer.

Speaker 4: 9:34

Yes, and you will find that they will have different characteristics, even though they're the same blends. Due to size, due to the shape of construction, a few other factors, they'll have their own nuances.

Speaker 2: 9:47

They will not taste exactly the same, Alright so we've been dancing around the subject a bit of the cigar construction. So let's dive in and Paul take us through the components of a cigar. We're going to talk at the 30,000 foot level here, Like, just break it down for us.

Speaker 3: 10:04

Alright. So basically in a cigar you're going to have three components. You're going to have your wrapper, which is what you see that's a lot of what you're going to feel and taste on your lips and then you're going to have the binder which kind of holds everything together and inside is the fillers. So when you say that it's something like, oh, there's just three leaves in there, but a lot of times it's a mix of different things. You might have five or six different regions and or countries of cigars in there, sometimes less, sometimes more so, and that's really what we'll talk about with the tasting.

Speaker 3: 10:38

A little bit they're trying to get that across. Each region and each type of plant has its own characteristics. It's really kind of a cool size experiment, kind of tasting and trial and error of what works with the other ones. But yeah, so you really have your three main components, but what is in those components can vary drastically into what Tim was talking about with size a minute ago. If you look at like a six by 60 cigar, which is a big cigar for most folks, and then you look at a normal Toro size, which is typically a six by, say, 50 ring, it's visually a big difference in the diameter of the cigar. So what that changes is your proportions of how much of each type of tobacco in there, and that's what can drastically change your flavors and profiles within the cigar, even though it's the same components the proportion can change a lot.

Speaker 2: 11:41

Let's start with what people on Connecticut know very well, which is the wrapper. Connecticut shade leaf. Connecticut broad leaf. These are things that most nutmeggers know something about. So, tim, what's the influence and what to look for when you're, when you're considering the wrapper?

Speaker 4: 12:00

The wrapper. Actually, the majority of the flavor of the cigar probably 70% is actually the wrapper. That is the part that is contacting your lips and you're actually physically tasting before you. Even you know light it. So the wrapper is critical because each type of wrapper, each type of plant has its own characteristics.

Speaker 4: 12:27

So you know, you mentioned Connecticut shade wrapper, which is one of the most sought after and most expensive wrappers in the world, because of a few factors. One it tends to be very mild but smooth. It also has very little veining in it, so it's really almost like parchment. It's delicate but it's very, very smooth. So it's appealing aesthetically, into the touch as well. Then you mentioned Connecticut broad leaf, which is a much, much stronger flavored, more intense leaf. They're both, you know, grown here. As well as those plants, those seeds have been planted in numerous other countries now too. But the wrapper is going to give you a whole different characteristic. You can put the same other components, the same tobaccos, in your binder and in your filler, but with a different wrapper it's going to smell completely differently.

Speaker 2: 13:16

Well, okay, let's do a quick breakdown, if you guys are willing, of the different wrappers and how you might categorize them, like you know, if we think of Corojo or you know things of that nature, like how would you break down? I know that there's a big, big movement with San Andreas wrappers, but if I think, maybe if the listeners have an idea of what those different regions kind of mean on that flavor profile.

Speaker 3: 13:46

And there's so, there's so many different variations. It's a test fall.

Speaker 3: 13:50

It is and it's a many multiple choice answer, but there are so many, right? Silicuclastic Romeo 1875. That's an Indonesian grown wrapper. You have a lot of Connecticut shade stuff like Timberstam out, Connecticut broad leaf. There's actually Connecticut grown Havana waskero.

Speaker 3: 14:08

You find on the flat head steel horse, for example, what is a skiro? So a skiro is just a darker aging process, A lot of what chain is. So you let me back up a second you can take the same components, give them the two different blenders and they might taste completely different. And a lot of that is how they're handled and how they're cured. Most of the leaves that we're tasting on these cigars have age in an aging room for two, three, five years, sometimes 10 years, sometimes more, just to get the flavor quite right. So these blenders, when they're figuring out what tobacco components to use, they're also figuring out how the agent, what intervals are they changing the piles around, what temperature do they want the tobaccos to be as they're aging and fermenting. So it's kind of a somewhat similar process to wine. It's a slow process where you're looking at that long-term finish.

Speaker 2: 15:08

The dark wrapper is fermented longer, essentially.

Speaker 3: 15:11

Well, it's also given more sunlight and there's some other given it more heat. So there's a couple of different things that you can do and how you do that will determine the outcome of flavor at the end.

Speaker 2: 15:24

All right, so let me see if I understand it right, ascaro and Maduro is more of a process, whereas some of the other things we talk about are from where they're from. Is that?

Speaker 3: 15:36

correct. Yeah, it's more of a process. I mean, there are some tobacco seeds, however, that will grow a darker tobacco versus a lighter tobacco as well. And you look at the Connecticut shade versus the broadleaf. There is a slight variant in the seed as well, but so it's a combination of the seed and then also how it's taken care of once it's harvested. It's pretty wild because when you look at the total cigar by the time you're talking about, from seed to when you're lighting it up, there's over 300 sets of hands that have touched that cigar throughout the entire process of all the growing and then the clipping of the leaves, the hanging and then the aging process and then the rolling, all that stuff that goes into it. It's pretty wild, pretty intensive.

Speaker 2: 16:20

Yeah, well, I think, as we kind of dive into these layers of the cigar, one of the things that we'll be talking about is the actual tobacco plant itself. And when we think of a tobacco plant oftentimes at least, I think of it also in threes is three different parts of the plants that are used for different purposes. So, Tim, what are those three parts of a tobacco plant when we think of it in the cigar world?

Speaker 4: 16:51

Well, basically it goes by, they call the primings how high on the plant that the leaves grow. So basically the uppermost leaves that get the most sunlight. So the plant naturally kind of pushes most of the nutrients up to where all that photosynthesis is happening. That's your leharo, okay, and then what's below that, in the kind of mid part of the plant, is a viso, and then below that, the lower part of the plant, is the secco, which is basically it doesn't get as much love, it doesn't get much sunlight, it tends to be a little drier, it tends to have a little less flavor. But those are the primings that they tend to use for the binder of the cigar when we're talking about the construction, because what it brings to the table most is it brings the least amount of flavor. But that controls the combustion of the cigar because it burns better. It's not as rich and as moist, as moist in its makeup.

Speaker 4: 17:52

So, that actually controls the combustion of the cigar.

Speaker 2: 17:55

So we've learned. We've learned that when we're thinking about just on the wrapper side, that there's a region that determines the wrapper, there's a process and then there's a part of the plant. So those are three important things to kind of think about when you were just thinking wrapper before. But so is leharo typically what we've? I mean, I've heard a lot of cigar reps talk about leharo on the wrapper. Is that most commonly the wrapper? Or you see Vizo on the wrapper just as much.

Speaker 3: 18:29

It's a good mix out there. It really depends on what the manufacturer and what that blender is trying to get across. You know, when you think of leharo most people go to an LFD double leharo. That's what pops into your mind and that is just a lot of leharo tobaccos and you taste it, you feel it, it's got the strength, it's got the flavor, it's got that kick to it. But it can be used in different components. Like you know, rick Rodriguez from West Tampa Tobacco likes to use the leharo inside his black label line because it's a media body cigar. But then that leharo in the filler gives it that little bit of pop, so it gives you that little excitement on your palette, which is what he uses that for. So it really depends on what your goal is with the tobaccos.

Speaker 2: 19:15

Yeah, it sounds like there's some worth wildness I guess, to make up a word here in investing some time in understanding the wrapper because, as Tim said, it's 70% of the flavor and there's a whole lot of terms going on determining it. So you guys help someone dial that in when they come into the lounge, but it definitely helps to remember those little bits as you go through. All right, so we spent a bit of time on the wrapper. Let's go to the next layer, which is the binder and Tim, you started to talk about that a little bit. So the binder, you're saying, is sort of the least important on the flavor side, but it's very important in the construction.

Speaker 4: 19:58

Yes, I mean it does have its flavor influence on the cigar and they use a whole plethora of different types of tobacco, different types of plants for the binder. That definitely will influence the flavor some, but it's not the boldest part of it. But basically, when they begin to construct a cigar, the binder leaves are what they're going to start by laying out first. Then they'll take the filler leaves and put those in, lay those across the middle of it and they'll roll it. So once it's rolled with the binder leaves because the binder leaves aren't as fine and as refined looking as the wrapper it's going to look very rough and then the wrapper is put on the outside to finish it off. It gives a finishing flavor and it also is basically like your finished coat of paint. It's like your clear coat over your paint job on your car.

Speaker 2: 20:53

Well, you're mentioning that the bottom part, the Seiko, was drier and that's used in the binder. Does that mean that it burns faster?

Speaker 4: 21:04

It. Basically it burns faster but it burns more consistently. So it's kind of used as the control, almost like a wicking feature where that's going to control the temperature of the burn better. It tends to be not quite as dense as some of your higher primings of the plant, so it's a lot more consistent. Because some of the filler tobaccos are, you know, because they're richer they tend to not burn as well, so they kind of need that little extra kindling around it to control the rate of combustion.

Speaker 3: 21:38

And even though, like it's him saying, it's not a major factor to the flavor, the binder is still important in that realm for the binders.

Speaker 3: 21:46

For example, maybe two options. So, like the Cavalier Black II cigar is a San Andres Maduro, so you get a lot of that Maduro flavor on your lips and then it uses a Habano binder underneath it so it gives you that little, just a little faint pop to it. So it's not very strong but it just gives you that little tingle on your tongue from the Habano spiciness. And then, differently, like the Partigas Valley of Arti, which is a brand new cigar about two months ago, also uses a San Andres wrapper, but then it uses a Cameroon binder that was aged for eight years. So you're going to get the Maduro flavors and the Cameroon is a very smooth and rich flavor. So it kind of bounces out the strength of the Maduro, keeps that cigar right in that mid-range and then, of course, works with the fillers to kind of give it some more sophisticated flavors as you roll through it. So, while it doesn't impart as much as the wrapper, it does parlay into the overall experience, which is pretty cool.

Speaker 4: 22:48

It also brings the Cameroon and the binder also brings a little touch of a sweet element to it as well, Because that's kind of one of the features of the Cameroon is a little bit of sweetness. So it's not overwhelming, but it all has its influence and makes a difference.

Speaker 2: 23:05

So we kind of covered a good bit on the wrapper, the filler. I'm thinking that this sounds like it's imparting a lot to the process and somewhat to the flavor. Now the third part. If we think in the food world like this is a dirty word like fillers, we don't want fillers. So is that true? In cigars Is fillers kind of like what's left over your stuff in there? It's just really important piece.

Speaker 3: 23:32

Well, in a premium cigar there's no leftover stuck in there, right?

Speaker 3: 23:37

So every layer of the cigar is meticulously planned by the blenders and most of the time your cigars are going to have two, three, four, five different types of filler tobaccos in there, just because each one is going to bring its own flavor to the party. So it kind of adds a mixture. So as you're smoking a cigar you pick up different notes of things Maybe it's a little bit cedar, maybe it's a little bit of nuttiness Lots of different options that you can get out of the filler. But a premium cigar is all full leaves throughout the entire cigar, in every layer, which is different than like you might get some chopped filler.

Speaker 3: 24:20

You know bundled cigars or your machine made stuff that you can get at the convenience store. Those things are a little bit different, but a premium cigar is full leaf throughout every layer and it's all carefully planned.

Speaker 2: 24:35

So you mentioned it. We didn't really talk about that, but there's a sort of a really big divider, the very big end of the cigar roll. It's just machine made versus handmade. Machine made is typically, just like I said, a chopped fill with a wrapper on it, or it can be a variety.

Speaker 3: 24:53

Yeah, I mean you know it's a way to use leftover ingredients into something else productive, so it's a very cost effective because you're looking at these tobacco farms that are growing these long leaf fillers in tobaccos for cigars and when there's stuff left over they can sell it to use in the short filler or machine made cigars and it makes a value proposition.

Speaker 2: 25:22

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 25:22

You know and there's nothing wrong with those cigars either it really comes down to preference and that's where it gets into the budget too. So you know we have some that we go through a ton of called factory smokes from Drew Estate and they're all mixed filler, you know, but they're fantastic cigars for a few dollars a piece. You know, you're looking at three or four dollars for a cigar and you're still going to be able to sit down and have a good time and enjoy your cigar.

Speaker 2: 25:49

Well, Tim, what impacts the cost of cigar? The most of these components we're talking about.

Speaker 4: 25:56

There's a number of factors. A lot of it has to do with whether it's a high or low yield. So essentially your leharo, your top leaves on the plant. There's not as much of that on each plant so it's a little more rare. So for when you grow X amount of tobacco, only a small percentage of it, the least percentage is going to be the leharo. So that drives the cost up because you know you're not getting as much of that tobacco per plant, so it's a little more scarce.

Speaker 4: 26:31

Just like you want to get into similarities to wine grapes, I mean some plants are more difficult to grow. Some take a lot more water and a lot more tending when they're in the fields, more labor intensive, and a lot of times you take a plant that needs a lot of extra water because they don't use pesticides. It lends itself to more infestation from insects and more mold, which causes them to actually have to discard a lot of those leaves. So I mean those are big factors in the cost. The other cost factor is where it's grown. I mean let's be honest, if what it costs to pay somebody to work in the tobacco fields in Connecticut isn't the same as Honduras or Nicaragua or somewhere else. So I mean there's also economic factors from the location of where it's being produced as well.

Speaker 3: 27:27

And also you're getting into how long that stuff is stored, like we talked about one of the examples earlier with an eight-year age camera room binder. So you had to house these piles and piles of tobaccos for eight years and you had to have people periodically rotate those piles and move them around, and so there's a lot of labor hours involved as well. And the other thing on, you know to make some great points on the moisture and that kind of thing, a lot of times you might end up. In Connecticut, for example, we've had seasons where it was extremely dry and the tobacco couldn't grow properly. This year we had extremely wet season and there's a couple of farms that we had talked to where their crops were basically ruined. No one would buy them. They had to basically till them under the ground and say we're going to have to start again next year. So those factors also play into it too. Like you know, every same it's the same for tomatoes or corn or different things.

Speaker 2: 28:22

So you say there's a terroir with cigars, like in the morning world, right, yeah, I mean you're going to have a bad year, so that's all factored into it as well. Yeah, the beauty of a cigar lounge is where you can actually experience it, Not just talk about it. So we're going to. I guess we've been breaking down the components of a cigar and, Paul, you had a vendor that gave you an opportunity to look at your customers, try what that actually tastes like. Can you explain that?

Speaker 3: 28:53

Absolutely, and that goes back to the beginning when you asked about the cigar lounge experience versus buying cigars elsewhere, because we have directly ships with a lot of these vendors, you know we're able to do some really cool things. So we had an event with the agonizing leaf company a couple weeks ago and what they did is they also gave us some individual components that actually make up one of their cigars. So what we'll actually do is you actually get to taste a couple of different types of tobacco grown in different regions, different types of different layers of the plant Similar to what we were just talking about a few minutes ago to kind of get into how you develop those pallets and how the blenders are actually developing these flavors and what we're tasting as the final result.

Speaker 2: 29:35

So this is constructed with a like we talked about, or is it constructed of one component or how is? Are these individual cigars?

Speaker 3: 29:44

So these are going to be so not complete cigars, there'll be individual components. So you'll taste one component and you're going to kind of see what kind of flavors you got at one component. Try another component and it's going to be completely different. And then we're going to put those two together and it'll change completely from that point. And there's also a third component as well. So these three components is that actually are all from Nicaragua, all from the Agonorza Leaf Factory. So one thing that's really cool about the Agonorza Leaf Company is they have their own 2,500 acre farm in Nicaragua where they grow a lot of their own tobacco. All of their cigars use a certain amount of two of these types of tobacco we're gonna smoke in a minute. They all use a certain percentage of those in all of their fillers to work with the flavor profiles.

Speaker 2: 30:37

Well, I'm excited this sounds very interesting and looking forward to trying it. So I'm gonna, I guess, spark up the first one.

Speaker 3: 30:45

This is gonna be what part? So we're also joined by our friend Mr Tony over here. Mr Tony Suarez.

Speaker 2: 30:53

Oh hey, Tony Good welcome to the show.

Speaker 3: 30:55

Yes, it's exciting.

Speaker 2: 30:57

Have you ever broken us a car down like this before?

Speaker 5: 31:00

Not like this. No, in fact, I just recently educated myself I've been smoking for a while that in many cases there's actually three distinct flavors on the same cigar as you continue to burn. So you get to enjoy one flavor at the first star and then it could change to the second and then yet again to the third. Very few are consistent all the way through, so that was kind of a neat experience to start paying attention to it a little bit more.

Speaker 2: 31:25

All right. Well, let's light them up and see what we think.

Speaker 3: 31:29

All right, so I'm gonna hand you guys the first sample here. These are little teeny things huh. So it's a pure leaf, and what?

Speaker 2: 31:36

it is is.

Speaker 3: 31:37

it's from the Halapa region of Nicaragua. So this is a Corojo seed and it's a Vizo, so that means it's from the middle of the plant, which is not gonna give you an overwhelming strength, but it's gonna give you a lot of flavor. So this is actually one of the Cuban seeds that was brought over years and years and years ago. So it's a Cuban seed. Corojo the agonorza it's their own proprietary tobacco that they grow from start to finish. So you're gonna get a little bit of salivation on the side of your mouth from it. Activate your palate a little bit.

Speaker 4: 32:16

It's not overwhelming.

Speaker 3: 32:17

It can give you that very light spiciness, little bit of sweetness up front as well. So it kind of has like a little bit of a balance. Now you're right.

Speaker 2: 32:25

Now I've heard some terms when you're going through a process of understanding a cigar, things like smelling the foot and retrohailing and cold draw. What does this stuff mean?

Speaker 3: 32:37

Well, so hard to do with what you're smoking there, because that's just a singular leaf component, but something that we'll talk about afterwards, once we put them all together. But it's definitely things that can influence your palate and open you up to more flavors that you can sense. So what are you guys getting out of those thus far? So the whole.

Speaker 2: 33:00

It's pretty light. I think I'm trying to pick up a bit of flavor. I'm wondering if, as you get into it, because this little way it's wrapped, it's very airy. Again, it's too harder to draw, so it's kind of a different experience.

Speaker 3: 33:16

Yeah, the Halapa region Nicaragua is known for that. It's not known as being a lot of powerhouse cigars, cigar components. Halapa is known for being very flavorful and it's known for mostly being in that mid range as far as your strength, but usually a good amount of flavor, and especially on the VISA, which is the middle of the plant, where it kind of imparts a lot of those factors into it.

Speaker 5: 33:41

You're right about the gland getting salivated from that. It's interesting how that does that. I'm not in a habit of smoking a leaf but it's different.

Speaker 2: 33:50

Well, that was a long time ago.

Speaker 5: 33:52

So this is quite a bit different.

Speaker 2: 33:54

That's a different leaf people draw. Yeah, and I can still see straight too.

Speaker 5: 33:57

It's great.

Speaker 2: 33:59

So I'm picking up a little bit of cedar and I got a little bit of a barnyard kind of taste to it.

Speaker 3: 34:07

So there's a whole flavor profile to talk about what you're tasting Absolutely and we're going to change that a little bit by moving on to the second component here, and then you're going to get those going back in a minute. So, whereas the first one was a Corojo tobacco from the Holoppa region. This is what we call a Criollo tobacco.

Speaker 2: 34:34

So Criollo and Criollo.

Speaker 3: 34:37

So C-R-I-O-L-L-O Criollo a.

Speaker 2: 34:41

Criollo, depending on who you talk to, how they pronounce it.

Speaker 3: 34:45

So, whereas the first one was from the Holoppa region, this is from the Esteli region of Nicaragua, which, when most people think Nicaraguan going back to misnomers and such most people think Nicaraguan they think strength Most of times. That's going to be the Esteli type tobacco that you're smoking right now. It imparts more earthiness, more grittiness, it gives you a little bit more going on than the Vizo.

Speaker 2: 35:10

Oh yeah.

Speaker 5: 35:12

Definitely more vibrant. Yeah, they hit me right off the bat Huge difference.

Speaker 2: 35:16

right, We'll kick, we'll spice to it.

Speaker 3: 35:18

And that's the wild thing You're talking about the same country a couple hundred miles apart, but vast difference. And a lot of that's the soil. So the Esteli region of Nicaragua part of what gets a lot of that unique flavor is that it's very rich in volcanic soil, which is different than the Holoppa region.

Speaker 2: 35:36

Oh yeah. So one of the things I like to do is retrohouse. You push the smoke through your nose and when you do it with a spicy cigar, it lights you up man.

Speaker 5: 35:44

Your eyes start to work. There's a cayenne in here and if you add that with a cocktail, it's like OK, all of a sudden I'm drinking twice the strength I think, though, if a cigar was made of all this, it'd be too much.

Speaker 2: 35:57

It's got a lot of intensity to it.

Speaker 3: 36:00

And that's why you have a lot of these things blended together. I think there are some Nicaraguan puros and there are Honduran puros, and there are a lot of those out there as well which get you somewhat closer to this experience, but that's why the blender spends so much time tasting and then mixing and experimenting, which is the next step for you to. So, if you want to grab your first one and now smoke them both together and you'll see how it's completely different.

Speaker 3: 36:29

I said, and this gives you like a little taste of what the blenders are doing when they're out at the tobacco farms, they're out in the fields.

Speaker 2: 36:40

I may have lost a lot in my first one.

Speaker 3: 36:47

But now you'll start to see a little bit more of a cigar type of feel, whereas you're getting pure leaves, you're getting pure notes from that one type of tobacco. Now you're getting a little bit more well rounded flavor profile.

Speaker 2: 37:04

It almost tastes a little bit like hazelnut, almost, or talk, with the kind of flavor coming through. That's wild.

Speaker 3: 37:10

The crazy part is it almost doesn't taste like either of the two individuals at all. Combined it's like a whole new mixture.

Speaker 2: 37:17

I mean, the first puff of the Estilee was really good, but I immediately said this is going to be too intense. And so now it's actually calmed down.

Speaker 3: 37:28

And that's where you're using those different regions and different tobaccos to do that. They kind of figure out how to balance them all out and give you a well rounded smokey spirit. Sometimes you'll have a cigar, though that is the opposite, where they actually do want to blend it to be bolder. Some people want that bold cigar and that's kind of part of the fun of it. So you can take that same tobacco leaf, but if you're using the top of the plant, the little harrow part, like Tim was talking about, as opposed to the visa we're using here now, you're going to step it up even a little bit more. It's going to hit you a little bit more.

Speaker 2: 37:59

I came to one of the events here at Horsepower and Nick Goss was here.

Speaker 4: 38:05

And he's a character right. And hey, Nick.

Speaker 2: 38:10

And he was telling me about design cigars that the Seiko is. If you think about a baked potato, it's the potato, and without the potato you're just eating toppings. It's not the same experience. So you've got to have those other components. Oh absolutely.

Speaker 3: 38:29

I mean you can go out there and you can one finger a piano and you can make notes, boom, boom, boom. But then now you start playing with both hands whole different experience. Now you've got a tune going and that's kind of what we've got going here. You start out with one finger on one key. Now you're starting to hit a little bit of a broader range.

Speaker 2: 38:48

So this is an amazing experience that you can have at Horsepower Cigar Lounge that you can't do by ordering on a catalog, so you've got to get down and try these kind of things. You also have events most every month, right, a decent size event.

Speaker 3: 39:04

Yeah. So we actually have another event coming up. On November 3rd we have Dumbarton Tobacco coming in. We're actually rolling out a couple of brand new lines red meat, lovers, cigars, krakatoa. Few weeks ago we had Karen Burger here. On October 13th had their cigar rep here. They make a lot of fantastic cigars, especially at their Cameroon, which we talked a little bit about earlier. But we always have different things going on. We do ladies nights periodically. You know, last ladies night we had two dozen ladies in here smoking and having a great time, and that's really what it's about. But what's the Finish up the tasting here? So we have one more component for you, Mr Mark.

Speaker 2: 39:43

I jumped the gun, all right. Even more it's like an infomercial.

Speaker 5: 39:47

It keeps on going. Hey, wait, wait, wait, that's more.

Speaker 4: 39:49

It's longer, but do this one individually yeah.

Speaker 3: 39:54

So light this one up on its own. So this is also a Corojo seed tobacco.

Speaker 4: 40:00

However, this one is from Estelie.

Speaker 3: 40:02

It's from the Viso of the plant in Estelie. So this is from the Corojo 2012 variant and you'll notice that it's completely different than the first Corojo. The first Corojo was from the 98 variant.

Speaker 2: 40:15

Yeah, it's also a tighter draw.

Speaker 3: 40:18

Yes.

Speaker 2: 40:20

How much does airflow change that kind of thing? Airflow is huge.

Speaker 3: 40:23

And that's something that we'll talk about later on too. The difference between, like a round cigar versus a box press. But with this tobacco here you'll notice it's a lot different. It's a little more leathery in taste.

Speaker 2: 40:35

Oh yeah.

Speaker 3: 40:36

It's almost like a little chewy smoke, right, but that's again from the Estelie. This is my kind of smoke right now. This is what.

Speaker 5: 40:42

I go for and one of the things I got to say I enjoy most about coming here is you get this educated. This is as complicated as fine wine, all the different flavors and understanding it but you can come in and I love to try different stuff and these guys are great with not just trying this out but telling you about it so you get a better sense of what you're about to experience. This is good Try to make it unique and fun.

Speaker 2: 41:03

So this is really from the aging process, or is this the year, or is it a combination of all those things?

Speaker 3: 41:08

A combination of all of it and it's a different type of, even though it's a Corojo tobacco. So it sounds like the same but it's a whole different seed variety of Corojo and it's also grown in a different region. The first one you started was from the Jalapa region, which is known for being more middle of the road, very flavorful. The Esteli region, where this one comes from, has a little bit more of that earthiness to it. It's got a little bit more of a kick to it. So those first two components you smoked are actually used in all of the agganorza cigars. It's funny you can smoke different cigars in their line and they're gonna taste different. But a lot of that's also because it's different amounts of those. The percentage is different, sure. So one cigar might have more of the Corojo. So it's gonna have to be a little bit lighter, a little bit, little bit more spiciness on the tongue and if it has a little bit more of the esteele of the Criollo, then it's gonna end up being a little earthier a little bit stronger.

Speaker 2: 42:03

The difference between the two, most being from Esteele, is shockingly different, like like one is like in your face, like light your nose up, like you know, and I don't mind that. But I want that to balance and this is, like you know, it's kind of like a rum versus Bourbon or something else. It's a very different intensity.

Speaker 3: 42:25

So well, more of a leathery set to this so now, if you, if you put all three of those together, you get a whole different experience. So all three components of what you're tasting right now in total are the elements that make up the Cerberus cigar from Egon Orza. So it uses those first two that you guys smoked as the fillers and the binders, and then the wrapper is the 2012 Corojo, which is the last one that you smoked, which gives you that that that chewy leathery smoke on it as you're, as you're rolling through it.

Speaker 2: 42:57

Yeah, that definitely changes the balance. So in this case, what's the construction? So it's coming from the cigar. So what's the construction? Look like what? What parts are what in this cigar?

Speaker 3: 43:08

So in that cigar you're gonna hit, you're gonna use the Corojo Inside, coriolio out, I'm sorry, coriolio inside, corojo outside, and then as a binder, and then the Corojo 2012, the last Component is the wrapper. Ah, okay, all right, so it's so. You get that, some of that lightness from the inside of the cigar and you get some of that chewiness with that, that wrapper on the outside of the cigar and I've noticed when you start cigars, oftentimes it's a different experience at the very beginning than the actual cigar.

Speaker 2: 43:38

Is that like oxidation or is that intentional?

Speaker 3: 43:41

Well, cigar will change from a variety of things that you mentioned airflow, air flows a big part of it, but also, as you're smoking it, heats changing. You know it's also how fast you're smoking it and how much you're puffing on it. You know how you cut the cigar makes a big difference to you know a flat cut will smoke differently than a v-cut versus a punch not huge, but they will have a slight differentiator to them. But the speed of smoke is is hugely important to how it smokes.

Speaker 3: 44:09

You know if you let your cigar go out you know, for a minute and then realize it's not a big deal, but your cigars out for half hour and you go and really light it. It's gonna. It's gonna be a little bit stronger.

Speaker 2: 44:22

We'll make an ashtray.

Speaker 3: 44:22

There are some little things that you can do to try and help it, but yeah, what a nice blend, though Definitely get the changing elements it it.

Speaker 2: 44:35

I would say that maybe the, the Other part that normally affect me more, the way we're doing it, maybe it is not as intense of that Rapper that this way than normally, but I definitely felt the change. Well, I have to say this has been quite educational for me and I hope our listeners have found this Fascinating. I definitely think we covered a lot, of, a lot of bases about the construction, and the beauty of leaf people Is that we're not stuck with one show and we're actually designed this To have several parts to breaking down. Not was just the cigar construction, but the regions, the flavors, intensity and even what you need to do in the cigar lounge To increase the quality of your experience. So I definitely have enjoyed talking to both you, paul and Tim, and Certainly looking forward to the next episode, paul, how can we find and follow horse power cigar lounge?

Speaker 3: 45:33

so we have our website at horsepowercigarloungecom, but most of our Communication is done through our Facebook page or Instagram page as a board, both that horse power cigar lounge. What we post up multiple times a day on Facebook Not only just events, but also just to let people know what's new in the humidor. We also have Tim's pick of the week, which is always pretty fun, and you know we also try to be educational with our Facebook posts to kind of let people know hey, here's this new cigar, but here's what it's about and here's what you can expect from it. So it's more than just hey, try this out. It's here's why you may want to try it out, so you can follow us for more tips and information.

Speaker 2: 46:10

And so what are some upcoming events that people can look forward to? To coming to horse power cigar lounge.

Speaker 3: 46:17

So Friday, november 3rd, we're gonna have Dumbarton tobacco here. We're gonna be rolling out a couple new lines from them, you know the red meat lover cigar line, a crack, a toa cigar, and also we're gonna have some of the rare and exclusive unicorn cigars. We can talk more about that later on as well. So I'm very hard to get stuff which, again, because we have direct relationships with all these vendors and companies, we're able to get those types of things for our customers.

Speaker 5: 46:42

Another great reason to come here.

Speaker 2: 46:45

All right. Well, I hope you have enjoyed our inaugural edition of leaf people and tune in next month. We're gonna be talking about cigar flavor and intensity and then we're going to dive, in the following episodes, into even deeper things, like the regions of stuff comes from and and how to best enjoy your cigar lounge. So thanks for tuning into ICRV and leaf people. We'll see you soon.

Speaker 1: 47:18

We hope you've enjoyed this showcase program leaf people, presented by horse power cigar lounge in Montville, connecticut. For a full sampling of the life interests we dive deep into on ICRV radio, go to ICRV radio comm and be sure to sign up for the free newsletter and get a better appreciation For all the programs we make available on a daily basis. I CRV radio, the stream feeding the river valley, where we make local matter.